Cardiff

Whether you're looking forward to kick-off or the final whistle has blown, this is the place for supporters of EVRFC

Moderators: admin, The ref, Henry Crun

JohnCoffey
Posts: 55
Joined: 09 Sep 2017 21:37

Re: Cardiff

Post by JohnCoffey »

First of all – congratulations to the club’s officers & back room staff for recently passing the WRU’s audit & securing a licence for the club to compete in the Premiership for another season. We owe you a massive vote of thanks.

I also thought the club’s decision to kick off at 12pm to give it the opportunity to gain maximum attendance on an international day was an excellent decision & in no way can be blamed for the poor attendance.

As for the game, this was a seriously weakened Cardiff side – there was only one senior academy player (Bradbury at lock), a few junior academy players, several squad players who rarely start for Cardiff & some players called back from sides like Penallta. They were down to 14 players for about 12/13 minutes & 13 players for 6/7 minutes - & yet they still looked a better drilled side & they still won.

And yet another side has improved its result against us in the return fixture compared to the result the first time we played them.

I genuinely believed that this was going to be a 5-point bonus try win for us !

Déjà vu - we have now changed the back row in every one of the last 11 games, & changed the half backs in each of the last 7 games – selection is clueless & the logic behind substitution decisions in every game is indeed “baffling”, - to be polite. We need to bring in new coaches now to give them time to settle in & work with this group of players so that they can make informed decisions ready for next season.
viewfromthestand
Posts: 404
Joined: 31 Dec 2013 16:08

Re: Cardiff

Post by viewfromthestand »

Perhaps instead of bashing the coaches time after time and making statements re players perhaps attend a home game half hour earlier and ask people like the team manager, chairman etc. some questions. They are approachable, they have answers and above all they may not post on this site , facebook or twitter but rest assured they read the comments . Not only do the coaches read these criticisms the players read these posts. So indirectly we can affect how they are feeling and worse still have them take the field with the weight of the world on their shoulders.
I can answer some of the rationale behind having three hookers on the bench for Saturdays game. It s quite simple really we have no one else. Josh Jacas is out for a while with an ankle injury . He will probably need surgery . Owen Jones is out for at least 8 weeks with a ligament injury. so we did nt have any other back row , 2 nd row alternatives. All three hookers have played in the backrow in the past and are all capable of playing at no 6. Rhys Clarke had a niggle and asked to come off at half time but continued on , so that s why he came off. Oaksy played with stitches in a head wound. I believe he has 11 stitches in the cut. Had we a replacement he would not have played. Jon Davies has asked can he play 6 not 8 and has a very good reason. Dan Babos is injured again. I gleaned this information from speaking to the team manager pre game and then to the chairman. We are looking at some new players but we are hindered by our current financial predicament . We don t have a millionaire benefactor and we are operating under MCCAWBERS LAW . income £1 spend 99p we survive. we could spend more than we make so income £1 expenditure £1.10 we fold bankrupt. Let s look at other sides who played in this town . Ebbw Vale cricket club played at the highest level of club cricket in Wales. Hosted Glamorgan county cricket team annually . Due to lack of money they have drifted into the lower leagues. Ebbw Vale AFC rose to the dizzy heights of European Football and due to lack of funds folded , never to be seen again. EVRFC is a big club and is being run by a dedicated group of people who want to see this club survive and flourish. But survival will depend on keeping the business on it s feet financially. We also, need to realise there are 16 semi pro teams in Wales but the class of player is not there to sustain this number of teams. This system leads to players being overpaid and they play teams off against one and other for the most money . We have talked to player s like Matt Allen we simply can t get near the money he wanted . We spoke to Ross Wardle again of Bedwas , we could not get any where near what he was were asking. Has anyone who has bashed our coaches this year looked at their CV's . Both coached their college team to win the British Universities cup for two seasons . Both highly regarded by the WRU and seen as quality up and coming coaches. Unlike Neil, Jason these guys have had the shackles put on them with financial constraints. At the start of the season it was openly said we are going to have to rebuild this season with a long term view of survival in the premiership when the ring fence is lifted. So , we are learning about some of our players , some will be there for the long haul and some won t make the grade required at this level. Does it matter where we finish in the league this season? Not one bit . The ring fence is in place so we are making use of it by trying players. Having watched every game this year apart from Chinnor away I can see a small improvement every game. We gifted Cardiff the game on Saturday by making mistakes. We will make mistakes as long as we learn it will benefit us in the long term. Bare in mind all the Dragons Academy players we were allocated and had hoped to rely on this season have either been injured or drafted into the Dragons match day squads. We had so much quality in those allocated players . Harri Keddie, Jarrod Rosser , Max Williams to name a few, they re all injured. I m not watching through rose tinted goggles and agree we have some problems but both coaches and players are working very hard to turn the corner. Rest assured there will be no wads of cash thrown away in the hope of a miracle cure. We are already talking to players who become available for next season so we as a club are not standing still . I understand that not everyone is cut out to work on committee or offer an hour or so to help the club. My final point about Saturdays poor crowd. This can be directly attributed to the early KO 12 noon was stupid. Cardiff RFC do not have a lot of travelling support to any game. We as a club sold all of our allocation of Wales V New Zealand tickets and this reflected on a large number of ever presents not being there. The stupid KO time was imposed by the WRU as the match officials are given a set time to complete the match and then travel to Cardiff for the match. It does nt matter if they were not going to the big game. Gross Stupidity but inforced not a decision made by anyone at EVRFC. A fact for info. Cross Keys v Cardiff two weeks ago . Keys took £700 at the gates. Therefore, 58 people paid to watch the game. With ten minutes before we kicked off on Saturday we counted from our perch in the stand the number of people on the bank . If they all paid at the gate we would have taken £168. A few more turned up with minutes to spare. So hereby lies another problem in the game people not going to games anymore. i hope there is some information that people may find interesting , some may not and continue to bash the club.
Stevey
Posts: 865
Joined: 24 Nov 2008 03:49
Location: Ebbw 60 years

Re: Cardiff

Post by Stevey »

Very comprehensive, informative answer vfts, I hope everyone can see that anything that can be done is being done. I know from previous experience how hard all the coaches, management a d volunteers work and on times it's a thankless task. It is at times like this that match attendees are needed most, for finance, support and morale boosting.
Malpas69
Posts: 1659
Joined: 01 Mar 2005 12:56
Location: Ebbw Vale exile living in N*****t

Re: Cardiff

Post by Malpas69 »

Whilst I appreciate that 'we have no-one else' in terms of back/second row cover, could we not have brought a player (or players) in on permit? There were no Championship games on Saturday (as far as I am aware) and I am sure that there are players out there with ambitions of playing in the Premiership who would love to have experienced playing for Ebbw Vale in the Premiership (especially against Cardiff).

In terms of hookers having to play in the back row, could we not have left Rhys Francis on? He probably has the most experience of playing there and also offers more bulk in the scrum - something that we were clearly lacking and which ultimately cost us the game in terms of conceding the scrum penalty which Cardiff kicked to win the game. You simply cannot concede that much weight in the scrum(s) at this level.

I agree in terms of 6 being Jon Davies best position, but it just highlights again that we are desperately lacking a 'ball carrier' at number 8. Cammy has the heart of a lion and if all players played with his effort, enthusiasm and intensity, then we would not be in this situation now. BUT, he is NOT a number 8. He is too lightweight and often gets knocked back and struggles to get over the gain line.

I disagree in terms of 'it doesn't matter where we finish this season', I think that it does. We are already planning for next season (which is obviously great), but it does nothing to attract players to the Club if we are floundering down in the lower reaches of the league. If people think that we are going to beat the likes of Neath, Swansea, Bridgend etc. when the league 'becomes one', then they are very much mistaken I would say on current form.

That said, I totally agree with 'living within our means' and I would never support forking out ridiculous amounts of money on one or two players which may or may not suddenly improve our performance. It is a real shame that we have not seen much of our assigned academy players this season, I think that they would have provided us with a much needed boost, especially the likes of Harri Keddie and Jarred Rosser (Harri especially to fill that 'ball carrying' number 8 void).

Whereas I don't think that the 12.00 kick off time did us any favours in terms of crowd numbers, I have witnessed a decline in numbers pretty much ever since we won the league back in 2016. The old adage of people will support a winning team very much holds true and especially this season. Numbers have dramatically fallen away - simply because we are consistently losing and the style of our performance and the product that we offer is pretty poor.
Crime in multi-storey car parks - that is just wrong on so many different levels!!
david brown
Posts: 335
Joined: 14 Nov 2011 15:54

Re: Cardiff

Post by david brown »

Many thanks for what i would call a comprehensive presentation of a great deal of the concerns expressed by contributors on this page.Losing becomes a habit and we need a win no matter how lucky or indeed ugly to lift the morale of all connected to this great club.
JohnCoffey
Posts: 55
Joined: 09 Sep 2017 21:37

Re: Cardiff

Post by JohnCoffey »

It is a good editorial & most of the content cannot be challenged but for accuracy I am not aware that anyone “continue(s) to bash the club” – but in fact the very opposite is true. The club & those running it have been constantly praised & thanked for their efforts.

There are 16 Premiership clubs and all bar 1 “are operating under MCCAWBERS LAW” & face the same challenges as we do. All have injury problems – as indeed did Cardiff on Saturday.

I am in total agreement that the financial viability of the club outweighs its league position. Players & coaches are temporary – they come & go, but the club is permanent, & that is paramount at whatever level is the consequence.

I am also in agreement that the class of player is not there in enough quantity to sustain a 16 semi-pro team competition of the quality necessary to underpin the professional game. It is in desperate need of a huge uplift in central funding if it is to do that.

I have no idea who Matt Allen is but every team will have its pay structure & hierarchy & will face the same challenges. Every club in the Premiership (bar 1) can point to losing players to higher offers & being outbid for new players. That’s the fundamental market law of semi-pro & pro sport – unfortunately, it could also ultimately well be responsible for the demise of the game at this level. The paradox is that the better players need less money to join the better sides but want more money to be persuaded to join the sides which have a poor rugby proposition – a category which unfortunately we currently fall into.

I cannot agree with the view that our league position this season doesn’t matter. If we are in the bottom 2 or 3 at the end of the season then that alone will raise the cost of keeping & attracting the ‘better’ players. To attract quality players just matching other club’s offers will not be good enough, we would have to top those offers – there are prudent men at the club who would not put it at financial risk which could mean we are left with those players in which other clubs have no interest. It will also make higher placed sides in the region a better proposition to the Dragons when they decide where they place their academy players. Without any doubt it does matter as it will affect our ability to attract players for next season who can make relegation a distant risk.

There is a lot of merit in points you make but they do not justify why we are where we are in the table & the fact that our results against the last 4 sides are worse than they were the first time we played them says that as a team we are not getting better relative to the sides we are playing ! And we have Merthyr & Bedwas to come - but hopefully, we will do better against Bedwas.

There is a massive gap between coaching a college side & coaching at this level. The game is littered with coaches & players highly regarded at school & college level who failed to make the grade at this level – indeed most do fail.
david brown
Posts: 335
Joined: 14 Nov 2011 15:54

Re: Cardiff

Post by david brown »

Just in case there is any misunderstanding,my comments were in favour of the article written by MALPAS 69 ,sorry if there seemed they were in favour of a previous presentation.
JohnCoffey
Posts: 55
Joined: 09 Sep 2017 21:37

Re: Cardiff

Post by JohnCoffey »

For similar clarity, - my post was picking up on some of the points raised by VFTS, and like David Brown I am very much in support of the comments made by Malpas69.
Post Reply